Okwui Enwezor 2023 - Kültürhane: Hope in the Age of Compost

Name: Okwui Enwezor 2023 - Kültürhane: Hope in the Age of Compost
Uploaded: 2024-08-20

Okwui Enwezor 2023 - Kültürhane: Hope in the Age of Compost

Open media record

Abstract

Abstract: For the third time, the Cluster of Excellence organised the Okwui Enwezor Distinguished Lecture in July 2023. Established in the memory of late art curator Okwui Enwezor, each year the lecture series presents a prominent artist, curator, or scholar who engages with ground-breaking contributions to the rethinking of arts in a global perspective.
On July 19 2023, the Okwui enwzeor distinguished Lecture featured the founders of Kültürhane, an activist community in Turkey. The lecture was entitled "Hope in the Age of Compost"

Origins & context

Title: Okwui Enwezor 2023 - Kültürhane: Hope in the Age of Compost
Language: English
YouTube playlist: Okwui Enwezor Distinguished Lecture
Date: August 20, 2024

Identifiers & sources

has URL: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2olOWBZCL8

Full text

Transcript: sorry R I'm GNA film you again saying your words uh dear guests dear friends I'm uh quite excited and quite honored to welcome you today for the lecture at iala house uh I remember the days uh we walk together uh side by side at the campus of Maron University wearing these t-shirts like you cannot see this t-shirt I guess but you will remember it uh I'm wearing this t-shirt today again uh and uh we were chanting that we want wanting peace is not a crime uh peace freedom rights resistance autonomy democracy that was the University and the country we dreamed of uh and 2002 212 the number of the academics who signed the peace petition uh we were very few because our colleagues were afraid to stand with us uh even though they believe that signing the peace petition is not an act of terrorism uh but we were never alone thanks to the solidarity we created together uh and cter H is a great example of that that solidarity uh that hope actually and also uh curean is a great example uh what arant described as the right to have rights uh my dear colleagues including bis andash here created culture H after we lost our positions at the University claiming that the campuses are not the only spaces we can reach the public uh students we can continue researching or creating art uh and uh also at that uh very moment we were punished with the Civic death uh the government and its supporters assumed that no nobody would listen to us anymore uh nobody would even see us and we wouldn't exist in the eyes of the public anymore but cter H created a very Vivid space of art culture resistance research and commment so that we can reach even more people uh than when we were researching and teaching at universities with the viid energy of cultur which stemed from solidarity we exercise our rights to the public Fair uh to create Commons after we lost our public spaces and Commons in our cities uh after we have been punished to Civic that U actually we all uh manage that uh with your energy I'm very thankful for that uh to both of you and to other friends who are uh making this possible uh cultur is among many other things the solidarity and critical hope we all need uh let me finish my Words uh also with a poem from na hikmet like my colleague already did uh the great humanity is the deck passenger on the ship third class on the train uh on foot on the causeway the great Humanity the great Humanity goes to work at eight mares at 20 dies at 40 the great Humanity there is enough bread for all except the great Humanity it's uh the same for rice for sugar for cloud for books there is enough uh for all accept the great Humanity the great Humanity has no shade on its soil no lamp on his throat no glass on his window but the great Humanity has hope you can't live without hope thank you so much and I'm giving the floor to youash to continue thanks thanks H thank you very much in fact after the words of Naim miket it's hard to pronounce something because everything seems to be said already by him ER but let me start by thanking you for giving us this privilege I mean it's an honor H to be pronounced side by side by uh by OK invisor because I mean when I look at his uh life story which did not unfortunately last long I mean if I'm not wrong he was he he we lost him at the age of 55 so he was too young to to to to lose but in that short relatively short uh time span life life long he did enormous unbelievable things so it's really an honor uh to be have this to have this opportunity to give a lecture on his name and besides his name so thanks a lot for giving that opportunity uh offering that privilege to us and and also it's not the first time that we feel the solidarity the support of your our colleagues our friends in byut and in in Germany in general and a few weeks ago I was there unfortunately I can I couldn't travel once more because of the shopkeeping business that I will try to summarize briefly in the following lecture uh but I mean this it the idea was simple just we said that we we will try at least to keep on doing what we used to do in the University as aam ER underlined we said okay you can take our jobs uh take our salaries uh dismiss us from the campus from offices separate us from our students and colleagues but we will find a way to continue what we know to do so that was the simple idea but then with the almost six years now uh we just developed the idea and now I started thinking that what we are doing what we're struggling what we're trying is not a unique experience here in Turkey here in in Turkey in Europe in the world in general as I will try to summarize it's a it's a we developed all together with with other organizations similar to us a a way of a technique of survival a technique of resilience and struggle uh towards not only the authoritarian States but in general the transformation of the society so I will try to locate our experience in a general in a more theoretical framework to associate our uh efforts with the ongoing transformation of a of a macro Paradigm so if you allow me I will I prepared a brief uh PowerPoint presentation but you are of course free to interrupt and raise questions or uh comment on what I will will try to share with you so uh so we from the beginning we we tried to describe cultur as a source of Hope or an island of hope uh because we were I mean this is not an hope optimistic hope that things will be different we will be better but we have to do something uh to be hopeful that's one of the sentences of our dear friend Blan shik in his book stories from this world he said uh you don't do things because you're hopeful but but you're hopeful because you do things so that's our motto in fact we're trying to do uh keep up the struggle to be hopeful we don't need hope to do things but we hope is the out output of all this process as uh as kerina and uh aam summarized in fact this is a story that began in the fall of 2017 and it was you see on the right hand we have the library on the left hand we have the cafe so the idea was just to uh free the books that our dearest colleagues had to leave behind when they they were leaving the country so we freed the books from the boxes to the shelves of a library hoping that their separation uh hoping to avoid their separation with the lecturers with the students with their readers but we have to have an also a cafe just to finance this this library and also that Cafe became a very open and uh free and very uh uh popular public space in which I will try to go through we organized hundreds maybe thousands of uh activities since the opening of the uh Library this photo was taken was taken in the fifth anniversary of our uh House of culture and as you see we we have friends from all ages from all professions from all ideological political backgrounds and for different motivations so that was the the thing that we designed from the beginning and I think we managed to to to to grow that Community now this community calls themsel as an constellation we call it constellation curan like the star system so very different Stars very different planets satellites from very different backgrounds and they became a community that's a question that we always face each time we apply for a funding for a project uh they ask us what is our Target group and we try to persuade them that we don't have a Target group instead we are trying to uh grow a community by by by by their own Dynamics so it's not that is there's no Community targeted by C but a community has Rosen has grown up in C so these people most of them did not know each other beforehand and could not know each other because I mean that's the idea of a pretext for uh getting together to meeting to to to keep becoming a a member of a group a community so that was the idea and as that's the let me briefly share with you this uh uh this short movie that we we produced two years ago I think but I have to stop it and share it again with them with the voice so that's a very short movie that in fact summarizes of all all our story and of our Ambitions let me try to share it again share sound yes yeah [Music] [Music] fore [Music] speech for speech foreign speech speech for foreign foreign speech foreign speech foreign speech forign speech [Music] for speech [Music] speee foreign speeech for fore foreign speech foreign speech foreign spe fore fore foreign speech foreign [Music] speech foreign speech foreign speech foreign [Music] speech after foreign spee fore [Music] speeech speee spe forign speech speech foreign for for speech for speech foreign foreign speech foreign speech speech for speech for speech forign speech [Music] fore foreign speech forign speech [Music] for foreign speech foreign speech speech [Music] so this well uh a short movie uh that we had produced for the movie festival of L Foundation that's also based in South Africa if I'm not wrong so the the the the movie is called for example curan with referring to the last poem uh giving when it's I mean the the the ability is to smell good even if in bad times so our ambition is to smell good and provide good odors to to to our to surroundings and in fact we in fact we we somehow uh manag to smell good and the last example of this good uh good odor let's say uh was during the earthquake as Pina said because that uh that I don't know I cannot show you that slide of the earthquake relief ER process but we the the the community organized uh very simultaneously and it started delivering Aid and support to the earthquake region so the first day we we already sent a few cars of equipment food tents blankets and uh after the fourth day we focused on the survivors who who had taken refuge in the city in Maron so for for for more than a month he provided uh accommodation nutrition uh equipment of fan and and also uh and also clothes so that was we did not aim that uh support but uh automatically simultaneously that Community got mobilized and uh provided relief help for the earthquake survivors so that's the important thing yeah not only I mean the disaster of course uh Earth Quake is a natural disaster but disasters can be political social personal whatever so we understood once more that having a community H having bonds with different uh people is very useful functional even crucial during times of Crisis and when we think in more broader terms it's not unique to the earthquake to this region not to the country not to the continent but the uh but the uh universe or the planet at least uh it's valid we going through and and and and transitional period all the paradigms that we believe that we referred started to melt down and we have to construct something new uh to to face to to to to respond the needs and uh uh conditions to of of these of of these new period and we call it age of compost uh that's you know you you you throw something in the in the in the trash uh can and it became it becomes either toxic uh waste or a very fertile fresh soil so it's our choice now it's we we wasting all the uh theories paradigm all the rules all all our beliefs they will become either wasteful toxic uh waste like I mean I will go through we can have parallels with the waste and the the melting social Paradigm but we have the chance we still believe in the chance of transforming this waste waste of the uh the mted Paradigm to a new thing a fertile fresh good smelling new paradigm so that's our idea when I go look at what we have trying to do so that's the stages of Decay if we think in terms of biological compost uh process that we refer to our friend n she describes the stages of decay of composting in three different processes first deoy oxygenate so when the the waste the the the the the waste group loses oxygen food becomes becomes poisonous and releases uh Metang gas in the in the air so when in the lack of oxygen what comes out is methan so a toxic uh tox toxic out out output so if we let's think this deoxygenation in in a social terms I more inclined to think that loss of oxygen is like loss of Justice in a society then you you lose the Justice the feeling in the Justice confidence in Justice Society also becomes toxic uh when we come together without the Justice like the homo homon lupus every everyone fights for its own uh own interest for own uh welfare because there's no justice system there's no justice rules that we become a toxic Society it's the second in fact is the second uh stage of Decay is compression so when you uh when you get rid of oxygen in a waste a lifeless compound becomes uh uh uh present so that lifeless compound only allows very little space in soil without able without uh a lot of space in the soil only organisms with short Roots can survive there so as a result we lose diversity in in the compound in the soil that that resembles for me like the uh like like our isolation with the automization GTO GTO ghettoization of the community since there's no justice we feel threatened by others so we take refuge among people whom we in we whom we trust those are kins relatives uh People Like Us similar to us so we become like compression we we loses diversity in the life in the in our ordinary life we try to come together to to cooperate with those like look that look like us and finally that the oxygenation lack of justice and compression loss of diversity transforms the environment to an acidic place because only those organisms that release acidic compounds can survive there so they that acidic organisms contribute to the toxication of the soil by producing toxic outputs and that's when we think in Social terms that looks like the uh the spreading of discrimination the language of hate because we are frightened because we we we take refuge in people like us and then we we develop stigmat we develop discrimination towards those others that we don't know that we don't encounter that we don't come along so it's like the uh decay of soil in the compost process that's the decay of society during those uh terrible days and difficult days so the result in Social terms We Lost Civilization we become more uncivilized because we are uh that social structure that Society becomes individ visualized it becomes unjust and it it's dominated by the language of hate so as a result like toille stated in his famous book uh Democracy in America we started we start to H establish relationships only with th with the people we trust only with the people like like us so the result of this loss of civilization contribute further to the Lo loss of civilization be we become instead of a society we become islands of communities islands of tribes let's say ghos in a society why uh civilization is important because I I very appreciate the definition of Richard Senate in in this point he he says civilization is needed because it protects people from others also it helps people to enjoy their life so it's a protection and a source of Joy so in with this protection and the joy we can only live together so it's not only civilization it's not only those politeness those uh legal sanctions but it's the peace in fact the peace with others peace with the communities so the the the uh the compost the Decay is like the loss of this uh loss of this feeling of uh uh security and this possibility of Joy so why I mean that we had to have those civilizations I mean that Concept of Civilization because you know human human being is a in fact very weak ER creature we can cannot uh run fast we cannot swim we cannot fly we cannot smell like other animals do and so we have to uh develop a technique to survive in this planet and that was the hands we started using our hands to develop and use instruments and use and and and develop techniques to survive in this planet but unfortunately this technique uh resulted our homy in this planet so we are the weakest creature but we we have we have become the most powerful dominant hegic dominant and hegemonic creature on this ter so it's it's generable a technique becomes an a technology like stickler stickler says so transformation of the technique into technology it becomes we're not dominating the techniques but the techniques dominates us as the as we experience with these technological instruments we have we don't know phone numbers of our closest uh kins and relatives we don't cannot find a way without that navigation we cannot spend a minute without a a mobile phone or with the uh computer screen so that results as sck L say that's the cognitive an emotional proletar isation of the society so he approves agrees with Marx with the this proletarianization of the worker class but he generates it he he he increases the scope of this proletarianization and he says we're not only eliminated by our instruments of of production but also the Lost bonds we are ated from the society from the the from the social bonds we normally had with the nature with the people with the work we do so the the the that's the in fact those three stages of Decay so loss of civilization and this cognitive and emotional pris pluralization in fact summarizes the transition we go through in these times those ecological problems is a result of this this growing growing racism is against this the the the loss of social justice is a result of this everybody tries to save his life her life or the life of uh their closest uh relatives so what we need to do it's like the transformation of the waste to a fertile soil we have to resemble the social like Bruno puts so Society the term social is like it's not like wood it's not like iron it's not something specific and concrete it's created it's reconstituted every time shaped by the character and actions of these actors so our our duty is to try to reassemble the social the civilization in senet terms so that we can again live peaceful with each other so how do we do it there is another uh there is another uh debate going on in philosophy in medicine this is the discussion about EP epigene epigenetics there I mean the the the the the question is that how do we think how do how does the uh opinion how does the idea comes out from our brain and it's either the brain brain or the neuron that we had have concentrated until now but epigenetics has discovered that it's not the neuron or the brain as a as a whole but the relationship uh connections and relationships among them so it's not the whole neither the the the atom but the relationship the connections the network of neurons that makes the the the the the birth of idea the birth of opinion so autop poesis so that every relationship like the relationship connection of neur neurons creates information so the connection of people creates that uh that social so to uh reassemble the social we have to adopt this uh perspective of epigenetics so that we again re understand the importance of relation relationship and the auto autop poesis that is potential in this relationship this is tur kich is a very I mean I admire him a lot he's a brain surgeon but he also uh thinks about these uh these epigenetics and he like another poem of of n miket he's not not the forest neither the tree but the relationship that makes the for Forest that the relationship within that ecosystem that we has to we have to concentrate so we if we want to initiate a change if we have have to if you need to p p pursue a transition from waste to compost to to soil we have to uh develop those moves those strategies that support that develop the relationship among us like the relationship of trees in a forest like the relationship of neurons in the in our minds in our brains so that became that becomes another makes me think of another very known Theory the Marxist uh theory of value as you very well know he States two there are two uh values in the in in this capitalist market system either there is the use value it's something is valuable because it's useful for us required for us or it's the exchange value the value that we obtain by selling it by making it a commodity so this is the use and exchange value so I just tried to propose another a third value in this theory of value is the Share value it's not because it's useful for us it's not because we gain money from us thanks to to it but also what about thinking about the Share value something is valuable because it's shared not not uh not because it worths money or not because it's very functional and useful at the moment but because it supports us it facilitates it's it's encourag to be together so let's think about the all our relationship with the system with the societ with the uh the environment with the society on these terms of Share value what is valuable uh becomes what is shared so what is shared is valuable in these terms that takes us to the famous uh uh approach of Commons you know the commons when you think in firstand it's it's the commment that those natural resources or cultural resources that are shared by many people so we come to the Share value in thinking about culture and environment what if we we start thinking this with the uh Society what if we try to discover or develop new uh new Vues of Commons New instruments of Commons that that makes us come together that helps us together around so that's the idea so I try to uh summarize this with the politics of Commons yeah the in in in at the urban level in a city in a town in a village whatever what we what do we need to discover or develop uh policies of Commons that would enable encourage facilitate our gathering that's the idea I was working on this politics of Commons before I mean in my previous life let's say when at at I was at the University then Cur gave us a chance to practice this politics of Commons so you can see cultur an or what we try to do here is to play with this politics of Commons and very modestly try to develop new strategies new practices that are uh valuable in in in reference to politics of such Commons so that's again we go back to G those stages of Decay and in her terms let's uh think start thinking about the Cure of Decay and reparation through composting not avoiding it it be to become a VTE but to uh transform it to a fertile oil so she again uh uh puts uh put three dimensions for this cure of Decay first entanglement de oxygenation The Cure of Deo oxygenation is the entanglement so we have to create diversity among people places knowledge with providing a pretext for these contacts secondly solidarity so not only to come together to do to to spend time but to uh uh to receive and give energy like the photosynthesis in the nature you have you you receive the sunlight and then you you you give out oxygen so not only in uh financial terms it can be in kind psychological contribution so give and take not only stand still uh side by side but also to to give energy and receive energy from those are uh next to us and thirdly circularity so we when we are giving and taking we have to over over avoid the accumulation of the outputs I mean we don't accumulate a tree does not accumulate oxygen but we accumulate money instruments uh materials so what about again it's the Share value it's not because we're gaining a lot of money but because it's circulating with different uh uh commercials with different groups so degrowth on the one hand so we have to avoid those uh the the ideology of growth more more money more places more space but also to share it with the others uh in in in this time so uh how do we command then how do we come uh how do we realize this politics of Commons I try to summarize again with four dimensions it's normally in Turkish I play with the prefix Hem Hem is like the come in in in English so I I know that it's not accurate these these uh these titles but I will try to clarify what I mean so the first stage is commemorate it's the first this relationship with the place we live in because we more or less like tourists we come we spend time but we don't know the history we know we don't know the past of the place we live so that AO the sense of feeling of uh opportunes we don't belong to a place we we are like just the uh tourists in a hotel house with the venues we we use so in cultur we try to uh support this sense of belonging to the place by by uh doing different things those two maps uh above the slide they are the walking tours in Marin one is the old old Center the other is the old commercial custom uh venue so we H we gathered information we located places that we can share that information with the Walkers with the tourists and we we published as a map as a digital tool and also as you see there are the bar the the square codes that you can use your phone to listen to that information so there are two two maps walking maps that that renders the past visible for the present uh fellow Town Town Town towns people secondly for example that was during the pandemic we started an digital encyclopedia that's M Wikipedia that you see below it's again that was the constellation that contributed to this we gave them usernames and everyone uh shared their information about the people about the events about the places and about the institutions of this place so now there is a growing Urban encyclopedia on man all the not only the serious very formal history but Al also those people who passed by and who just touched you with the building with the institution with the success they did so we're trying to render the past of Maron which is not a very old city unlike BYU it's it's on on on 150 years old this city but nevertheless it has a past it has a history that we need to remember we need to commemorate so that's the first if we know uh the place we live we we we develop a different kind of relationship with the place secondly collocate that was you you it was in the movie for example but uh you as you saw in the in the in in the movie we organized maybe thousands of activities in a very large scope of themes Sports literature movies music agriculture ecology even motorcycle driving sailing uh all all kinds of uh all kinds of uh themes that may interest some some of our neighbors some of our fellows men so that's the idea we created pretext for people to come come together it's not that that yes there are people who watches the movie and Le the place but we saw that we there is a community growing with these contacts with these encounters now those people who just came here to to listen to a concert to watch a movie just to listen to a Prof Professor lecturer but then stayed there and developed the relationship with the others so now we have a community from different backgrounds thirdly cogn cognize I mean this is not only the history sometimes because of you know the the the problems of media in Turkey we even cannot access we don't even have access to the information on the actuality we don't know what's going on in the city in the country because very restricted uh pressed press so we also we tried to uh uh share the knowledge about today so those two posters uh in fact there are three they produce uh three documentaries one on the uh on the organic agriculture I mean this fair trade the second one in which bis was one of the leading roles in this movie in the shadow of apartments that was an urban gardening or Urban agriculture uh agriculture experience and finally we didn't yet publish it but we we we produced the documentary on the graveyard of Mer it's very special it's very special because it's one of the few graveyards in which all all the religions lay together side by side so there are Christians Jews Muslims uh in the same graveyard so we we we tried to build an documentary on this graveyard to underline the uh importance and the importance of living together this Multicultural cosmopolit place where we live and also finally I mean we also for a long we don't do it anymore but we we were we had on on right we had a a Facebook uh uh uh Facebook event weekly that we discussed the actuality of medicine what happens in municipalities in the neighborhoods so that was like the news uh of of of the City Weekly News and finally for for a year we published menu funds in it's like the menu ordinary menu you see the uh the food and beverages their prices also but we put the stories in it about the city about what we do so it's like a local newspaper local periodical in which you have an access to what's going on or what has gone so it's like a newspaper and the other one is like a television uh movie and finally not only a sense of belonging not only encountering not only knowing but also it's the idea of cooperation it's an idea of organization and it's it shouldn't be like the other ones like the hierarchical larian organizations with a president with a with a council but we tried to create grassroot rtic romatic organizations there are different experiences from all over the world I mean there are housing cooperatives sharing homes the uh different uh share of accommodation unfortunately we couldn't yet it's one of our dreams but we couldn't develop project about accommodation but for others for example the organization of compost consumption to fair trade to directly contacting the producers a local uh uh food group uh raised from uh I mean it it it has started before curan but with curan events and Community it became a vivid food food food group we organized two different festivals of sharing there were local producers local artists local uh local local coros so we organized two different festivals in the uh the market Public Market just in front of cter other sports is important I mean the the that Sports not only that's for losing calorie to play to to that's ambitious but also Sports is also a pretext for for uh for be coming together the photo you see on the right left hand it's a photo taken uh after one of our sports activities we do it twice a week we play basketball and then afterward we sit together we chat we beer we we drink beer and a lot of ideas H concerning uh our own relationships and also the future of curan was born during the these post After parties of basketball matches so Sports is important it invites people and then it creates the pretext for discussing other things another one circularity it's the we Cur yes it's a now it's a foundation but also a business I mean it's a private company H but never tried to gain money tried to we tried to uh support the uh local producers with support the idea of exchanging and uh borrowing so for example on your left you see a food food food food box uh that the that we used during the pandemic because the cafe was closed but we were just uh we we knew that there are things that we we could do so we started cooking and that cooking we uh we bought the uh all the ingredients from those local producers or local markets we used no plastic so that was the idea of the fot box and also we used and bedes used the waste of these production in her garden so it was an an uh it was an also uh there we we distributed those lunch boxes we sold them but also people bought boxes for others in need so we distributed uh these food boxes without any money to syrians to Iranians to to homeless people around us so that's why the slogan of the campaign was uh this is not a launchbox like it is not a pipe uh so we said this are more than food in this lunchbox so that's the we try to play with this idea of circularity so that's I won't uh translate it uh uh this is I I have the uh I have the uh let's say I end the presentations with the very very important words of tunel Bora in fact despite everything I mean despite everything it's not just the just just a sentence of relief but also but also a source of uh resilience and hope uh that's what I began I end this so and now what next I I will just end with this this is our dream that is I we hope that it will come true uh at the end of this fall we are uh working I mean there is a park unused Park just next to C and with the used containers we are we started building a community center uh neighborhood cultural centers H there we we we we found some money but because of the inflation we still in need and we trying to find there will be a multifunctional pole kids ho a library of things an artist Hall and Repair Station and a garden a roof garden and and and also we will we will have uh more space and we will cooperate with other organizations in mine so that they will also have a place to to P pursue their activities so that's for tomorrow so if you come next year maybe you will we can offer a cup of coffee in this new environment uh thanks thanks a lot for your patience and in interest thank you so much usas for sharing all the ideas the thoughts the philosophy of being common behind the work you do I would love to invite VIIs now to come join us for a discussion and AAS if you want to you can stay you can discuss with us I'm going to rearrange a little bit I welcome like warmly warmly finally here it's finally here and who has to do the um who has to be the recipient of the little thing we have for you which is because you are how do I do that now like this please smoke us also words you know we have our dear frienda Alam who's a friend OFA house who did amazing artworks like these one we we asked him to produce a work for us that speaks to the um um vision of visor this is what he came up with it's a beautiful artwork in limited edition of Sil screen prce there's this is number four yeah number four now that is around the world the first one is in Princeton now with Professor chica Oka aulu the second one is at a Institute with s and the third one is in Cala with n violet and the fourth one is now with you in your suitcase and now later beautiful thank you thank you you can sit on the couch put computer there question all of it please yeah let me do let me put the computer here sorry guys oh my God I'm so sorry maybe he would rather see the public maybe I don't know I think I can you hear from the mic no M can you hear me yes yes I can hear you okay so if you have questions please ask to yeah I don't know whether nice to see you I I see you that's amazing thanks a lot I didn't know how much you were doing so I knew that K is a very different place that just but wow how many people are you and yeah I don't know I I want to come immediately I will come in October you're welcome every time always how many people are you maybe you can tell us a bit more about the group and how you organize that b or no he will I mean that that that that's a very difficult question we don't know the exact number because I mean this is not an association uh that people come uh the same people come to uh every every activity so it's it's it's always changing I mean downstairs meanwhile I was presenting there was a concert diffusion we we we we diffused the Paris uh concert of Deep Purple so people uh uh that one that is interested in in in in in their music came some of them don't come until another concert but some of them stay I mean during the concert one of our friends came and said why don't we organize a weekend walking tours close to to in our in our proximity so he will be the responsible of those walking tours and Rea and friend of us Was preparing the cocktail for the for tonight another one is doing the the the the the the production of the movie so there are a lot of people coming adok coming doing something and then we don't see them for a for for for a period of time and but he they come back and so it's a changing environment and that that's important because I mean people come people people do things bring their potential their abilities their knowledge their their dreams so it's that's why it's an changing Dynamic organization we are not among ourselves because everybody comes contribute something sometimes these sometime stays longer but it's a let's I think the constellation the I mean there's a WhatsApp group called constellation curan and there are 50 people active in in in in taking responsibilities in different organizations but in case of emergency during for example the earthquake we had hundreds of people either driving to to deliver the the equipment or uh finding houses or uh organizing the storehouse or taking the uh going back and forth to earthquake region people that we never met uh until that time but they knew us and they came they came here to uh deliver that that help but I don't have an exact number it change every time like the Euro Turkish L parity I mean maybe because uh if you have questions to it would be nice you could answer while he's here yes but I think we also want to hear you because like it's so beautiful to hear both of your ideas come in about composting about working the land about agriculture coming together and one of the questions I would have it's a little bit of big question so perhaps we chop it down I don't know but with that experience you had like um do you hear meas when I speak like that yes yes I can hear you okay like with the experiences you had with your enforced uh leaving the university your Works Space your care for your students yeah having to leave all of that quite abruptly behind um and finding new ways to to work with one another how like like all of the things you discovered you you found it you established um is there anything you missed about the old University or also is is there anything that the university that still exists like the university here for example can learn from your from the new ways you found to do Academia outside of Academia I don't know is it like it's like a big thing but no I think we can answer Le do you prefer to answer uh first why don't you start and then in fact the idea of University was already quite lost uh in our minds I mean talking personally before already we were expelled because of the government um in Turkey was all had already started um the the pressure to in the University so we I can say that we were already feeling a bit uh out of context um already when we were there so maybe we had the chance uh to um to have other interest areas or other uh other thoughts outside of the University so we we were already uh Thinking Out of the Box uh in a way and uh and through all these years we witness and is one one of the examples of it uh the the creation or the the the generation the the appearance of very different uh spaces groups of people or spaces or uh um some struggles struggles throughout the country uh very valuable ones uh who produce uh academic semi academic or some I don't know para academic things uh and representing what the real University should be and they do exist in the current turkey there are they are not one or two there are many some are small some are big but there are great efforts to uh to to create to produce outside University so maybe one day it will not happen immediately but if one day all of us go back or all of uh very uh honorable people who are in prison now are out of prison H turkey will change and universities will possibly change then um then we will have the university in our in our heads but now we uh we are all doing things that we want to do outside of the university and uh we don't belong to the actual University that's what I think what do you say I agree yeah I mean both of us B and neither byes nor me we had the ideal of University we didn't idealize it so that's why we had connections out of the campus with the Civil Works with with other with other uh projects we had carried out that was how Cur was possible because we were when we started this this this adventure we already knew uh people in in civil Civil Society in the in the in the the community that's something very important because we were not we didn't see it University as the relationship with knowledge students and other colleagues we we always had the idea of doing some something for the community not in an hierarchical position not to form them not to educate them but also to to to to uh uh to to interact with the with the society that was important because those those it was the early period of our dismissal it was after the petition but before the uh failed State c i I was invited for a talk in a in a live in a in aook book Bookshop in Mason and I said please support us because I mean this will start in the University but it will spread to to the city in general because Maron is a democratic secular City and the the the the the uh this this pressure on the University will sooner or later spread to the to the city as a whole and one of the listener raised his hand and he said what did the University do for the city until now and how how come you you asked for support now did you support us as a city the the university did the University support the city until now uh so so you don't have right to uh ask for ask for solidarity so that was import important I mean University behind the I mean not like by University I mean Turkish universities are gated communities really gated I mean you cannot enter to a campus without your identity or student card so it's isolated from the society as a whole and that's that's a choice because it's not the pro uh the the the production of knowledge opposition but also the reproduction of what the state favors so uh I there is nothing that I missed from the University I think that's why in fact unlike uh the the Justice sent me back to the university but I don't go there uh and I don't know how I will manage to start uh to be an again an academician so in short I don't miss the university in fact I mean this this in this transitional uh uh stage of time period of time I think University is also out outdated as an hierarchical compart uh with the compartments it's not I think it doesn't respond the needs the information knowledge needs of the of of of the present Humanity it's like the epigenetics we have to play with different disciplines with different domains of science so that we can create the useful knowledge for these times I think thank you both for that I just want to use that moment to acknowledge the presence of our students because what we always try to do is to um uh to enter the curriculum so we have one class that we always teach here it's called a history of art told along independent art spaces and one um one space Hann now so lot of lot of you have been working with you and on you and studying your practices and so on so I'm happy if students would love to ask a question or say something or whatever but later we will definitely hear music from um from oan sh who's gonna B [Music] okay of course please I like to later oh okay sorry yeah sorry so thank you for this amazing presentation all work you it's very inspired and very beautiful specifically you from the outside it's it's good to know that things are happening I was wondering if you could tell us something about because you said we have people from all kinds of backgrounds political backgrounds and so coming together and working actually in this kind of like community building and uh changing the society but also in Turkey political perspectives and positions and on a very like it's a battlefield basically right so how are you dealing with that what's happening there is it like I can imagine that they like very different positions very different backgrounds so how is it working or how do you make it I mean that's that that's some that's a question that we also ask to ourselves can you start can you start again because there was a cut in the in the okay now we hear you that that's a question that we also asked to ourselves I mean in this uh period of uh oppression oppression how come we survived since six years that we have some clues for that first it's not unique to us culture arts is still a space uh with a relative uh Freedom let say because I mean the the government does not understand this what we've been doing because they're not I mean they are oppression they know how to press pressure oppress people but they don't know what culture means so culture it's not only for curan now I'm I'm a reporter of a national project about similar organizations all around the turkey not in only in Marin but different kinds of artistic organizations cultural organizations uh survive some more or less let's say so first uh since we we we we did we're not like an um political political organization that we don't uh we we not stand as an opposant to the policies I mean directly with the slogans with the press releases we not we are not dealing with the problems because we I personally we know that we are not in powerful enough to uh resist to that that's why I prefer the word resilience instead of resistance we we're not here to fight against the state fight against the government we're trying to hold something a create a potential that that maybe in the future uh be a useful tool like in the disaster uh period so they're not facing directly against the state policies we are not a political organization we don't have affiliations neither with parties or organizations there are people from all all parties even from the governmental party the justice and development but they are here to uh listen to music watch a movie that's the first one and secondly I mean uh from the beginning we always that's how we started producing movies we uh we shared the talks or the or the events here Live on YouTube Facebook whatever so we we we use the the the transparency as a as a selfdefense system we said this is we are not a closed community behind closed doors what we do here is accessible through your uh internet browser so we didn't have a lot of civil police uh agents here trying to understand what they doing because we we were diffusing it online live simultaneously so we we played with the technique of transparency to show that we're not doing we not an a secret organization a secret political organization that trying to knock down the government and thirdly M is a is our chance because as I was saying it's a democratic secular City and they supported us I mean even we have the stigmat of of those dismissed terrorists people came here because they trusted us because they they s our sincerity that we not just like other political organizations that only focused on criticizing the government we we're not dealing with the present H we indirectly with relationship with the present but we are dreaming about the future about this this country and we we we planting seeds as I use sometimes as a metaphor it's not just an battlefield but it's an AG agricultural Garden here and those seeds may be may be May will become trees uh that may be useful in in a more active direct political uh struggle so we didn't experience a lot of uh uh pressures uh from from the state until now but it's always possible may I add that story that young student H please the woman the young female student who a wheed uh woman studying in the library um that's the story uh uh I think of this as a seed because is the only place in M where you can find the Armenian weekly newspaper a newspaper thing and that world young woman came to specifically to read AOS and she told ulash that uh this is the only place she felt as herself free and that she she could live as herself I think that that really shows I mean you you have a newspaper there you never know who reads it and sometimes there's somebody maybe you won't expect that person to read it but when you make it possible make it accessible when it this openness uh helps uh that the these people to find their own path beauti [Music] I just want to add to what said a couple of minutes ago about the university is sp integrated to the geographically to the city so I'm I'm Turkish I'm from coming from isir and I used to study in isir as well and then I quit my studies because of simil reasons many of my professors were like dismissed from the Academia the curriculum was like corrupt nationalistic racist uh stuff going around and I said yeah I have to have start from scratch and I moved to Germany started clear studying off studies and uh there was one particular culture sh when I first came here it was like I was looking to the address of the University's campus on Google Maps I was following it and like it said yeah you arrived I'm looking around I saw like student dorms which look like you know typical settlements I didn't know that I was inside the university already because the distinction or like the university idea of University in Turkey is like very isolated as life said we have like uh border walls and big Gates and you can enter police yeah of course horrible security people they are like I don't know acting like Sultans or something they they ask you what are you doing here I'm student I came to the university what could I possibly do I just want to enter and yeah spend time I don't know attend lectures and but it's like always a different atmosphere it's literally a big gate and isolated from the society and that that point I can understand that it's also uh making the university idolized as a elite thing specifically in Turkey I think it's also a lit in Europe in Western world as well but it's less visible than turkey that's what I wanted to add next as like my cultural sh thank you yeah I have more I more I have more Comm not question because two things one is taking up again the question by and the question University because I'm at University and most of us are in the one way or the other so your example shows at least uh that it's important to do meaningful things if we in University meaningful things to society that's one very small seed I would take from that and the other things what struck me even more is that you spoke in the beginning olash saying you don't need hope to become active but you have to become active to become hope and that you show very convincingly and I'm actually really tou I I mean you know that I'm following this situation tur been long long years and then always struck again and very trou to see the whole rizing and Al spoke about social death in a way the dismissal was meant for your so to death and what you're showing by these practices is seeds of social life yeah and that's still very amazing that we here in a situation which just has also political problems really the place and so on but we still in a very comfortable position compared to authoritarian countries like turkey and that we from you can learn this perspective on to hope and how and to become active and why activity becom home so that's not a question it's just a comment that's always touching me and again I know that already but hearing that again thanks a lot for that everybody thinking and like and and and also you must be tired because you did a whole garden today perhaps share with us like the because I think like we had some very metaphorical moments today um there I don't know if you realize that there used to be two olive trees outside of your Li house if you come in B said in shock that um it's very hard to kill an olive tree but apparently we manag I don't know we can talk about the day which because the metaphors we used in the garden thanks to our dear Gardener and [Music] Resident serious serious it's a serious thing um I don't know perhaps we can talk about this and also because one of our students toan who had to leave now she came with two plants because yesterday we said um always when you come to I house now I mean you don't have to do it always tonight or tomorrow we have our Z Fest if you want to bring a little plan like something you wish to see grow at you not because but because of the space it can be for other people bring it and we plant it and we will take care of it and zilan brought two plants just now to leave there but let's talk about the garden tiny bit and the idea of a garden very briefly um we had this this idea of making a garden a very Diversified Garden representing what EV house ises presenting with very different Origins uh coming together and becoming something else together as um as in that poem um I mean there is no no tree can live alone in fact no tree can they they need a force they need a community and the plants are like this they need a whole garden to become what they are and and the best Garden is a garden where you have many many different plants and that's why we wanted to have for example okra seeds for for Africa maybe maybe other some other uh people will bring other plants and the garden will grow but we also planted these uh these plants uh that smell nice when they're crushed like lavender like Thy and like basil uh you can find them now in the garden and maybe they will grow hopefully and you will be able to uh pick them once in a while and have a tea or put them in in your meals and um and also about the olive trees yes they they were uh in front of uh this building but they were uh dead and they were dry completely dry DED out with no leaves at all so you know Olive Tree is an evergreen tree and it is known as a symbol of immortality because it is quite impossible that but but I then I told then I told I mean I was ready to uh just uh put the blame on house or the or the community of here not to have taken care of them but then I thought they are in a pot whereas the Olive Tree of cuan is on soil and it thrived in five years it's six years it thrived it became a huge tree now but in a PO it is impossible so even even a tree like Olive Tree which is really very resistant very uh living always or finding a way to continue to live always they cannot live in a in a pot so we have to think of this when we think of um refugees maybe uh migrants people who are out of their out of their context and put in a pot how can they survive there how can they survive if they are not given any chances to thrive uh and then we put took them out of their boxes and we cleaned the the soil and we placed them next to the with Z we place them next to the uh plants in the garden H and seeing them all completely dry there maybe will remember us things uh each time we pass by the commemoration that yes yes and like funny that gardening because it gives so many um like like really tools to analyze a situation because paradoxically at the same time where while olive trees die here there's one plant surviving since the 80s we learned which is the child that II B who is the founder of I li house in 1981 had on his kitchen thing I don't know and uh generations of practition you have been taken care of that CL you can like we can pay two and I show you it's it's crazy think about that in terms of what do we remember who do we take care yes it was such an event for gardening afternoon have you made a garden there you would like to of course we're going to do a to now but not just now because we first want to say thank you and um thank you and please um stay with us always connected in the ways you want to we want to let's find ways to really collaborate and I think thank you from all of us for the Fantastic work you're doing for all of us actually so thank you thank you we thank you I mean the Val you cannot imagine the value of our I mean of your invitation because I mean uh what we are doing is not a project I mean we not I I I told a lot of things but n none of them was uh conscious was not theological we will just have the inspiration and feeling of doing something as the trying to produce hope but sometimes we are Lost in Translation I mean we doing things but sometimes we forget the the how it's seen how it what it represents so your appreciation by inviting us by honoring us with this lecture uh gives us more uh selfconfidence and uh and and and we we convince uh ourselves to to keep up the work I mean thanks a lot we're happy to we're happy to now what we want to do is to listen to oan play please we would love to hear you we want to hang out we want to discuss we want sorry people on zoom we're going to leave you now but I'm happy that our colleagues from the University of Petoria who we have a relation with as well I'm happy that Nicola showed up some of the students sh so thank you for that because we want to grow our relation as well and um thank you we're g to close the zoom now hang out have some drinks have music by oan and then do a little guidance okay thanks again and happy continuation oh sorry what did of course I need around like 50 minutes to no problem okay cheers [Music] by